Mathew and Me on Laptops, Chaos, Free Will, Scientific Thinking and Other Stuff

me: hey

Mathew: ah there u are
ure just the man i wanted to talk to
did yu buy a laptop??
me: u there?
Mathew: YEP me here
me: yep
12:18 Mathew: which one
im planning to buy one too
12:19 HEY??
u there?
<!– D([“mb”,”12:20 me: sorry, connection probs
Mathew: k speak
me: still around?
Mathew: k listen….im buyin a laptop and i need help now
12:21 which one did yu buy??
me: I got a Dell INspiron 6400, but only coz it was on offer and aeverything..not that it isnt good
DELL INSPIRON 6400
Mathew: specs
me: Its a good model
12:22 Mathew: specs
“,1] ); //–>12:20 me: sorry, connection probs
Mathew: k speak
me: still around?
Mathew: k listen….im buyin a laptop and i need help now
12:21 which one did yu buy??
me: I got a Dell INspiron 6400, but only coz it was on offer and aeverything..not that it isnt good
DELL INSPIRON 6400
Mathew: specs
me: Its a good model
12:22 Mathew: specs
<!– D([“mb”,” me: Centrino Duop 1.67, 512 MB DDR2 + 256 MB shared vid RAM
Mathew: how much was it in rs?
me: 15 inch monitor, just over 2 pounds
card reader DVD/CD reader+writer(both)
12:23 about 52K
+ an extra 3900 for 3 yr intl warranty
Mathew: oh k thats good….i was thinking bout an HP Pavilion
12:24 Pentium M 745 (1.8 GHz)
1 GB RAM
100 GB HDD
but the VRAM sucks…128 MB… not specified whether its Intel GMA
“,1] ); //–> me: Centrino Duop 1.67, 512 MB DDR2 + 256 MB shared vid RAM
Mathew: how much was it in rs?
me: 15 inch monitor, just over 2 pounds
card reader DVD/CD reader+writer(both)
12:23 about 52K
+ an extra 3900 for 3 yr intl warranty
Mathew: oh k thats good….i was thinking bout an HP Pavilion
12:24 Pentium M 745 (1.8 GHz)
1 GB RAM
100 GB HDD
but the VRAM sucks…128 MB… not specified whether its Intel GMA
<!– D([“mb”,” card reader
DVD/CD Dual Layer Reader + Writer
57 K
how is it?
12:25 and is Wireless LAN the same as WiFi
It doesnt have bluetooth
12:26 me: Centrino\’s probly better than Pentium, but everything else sounds ok…if u have a cell phone bluetooth could have bin useful, though. not that itll matter too much, but still
Mathew: it is a Centrino
12:27 Centrino is the technology, Pentium M is the processor
though yr Duo processor does sound cool
12:28 not planning to have a good phone anytime soon
“,1] ); //–> card reader
DVD/CD Dual Layer Reader + Writer
57 K
how is it?
12:25 and is Wireless LAN the same as WiFi
It doesnt have bluetooth
12:26 me: Centrino’s probly better than Pentium, but everything else sounds ok…if u have a cell phone bluetooth could have bin useful, though. not that itll matter too much, but still
Mathew: it is a Centrino
12:27 Centrino is the technology, Pentium M is the processor
though yr Duo processor does sound cool
12:28 not planning to have a good phone anytime soon
<!– D([“mb”,” so if i ever need bluetooth i can buy an adapter
did yu buy a phone too
do yu think i really need 1 GB RAM
cos its a laptop i wanted it to be future proof
12:29 me: Wwell, 1 GB is future proof…and I mant Duo, sorry
I boughta phone, yeah
nothing much
Mathew: cos if i go for 512 MB, there are really cheaper laptops with better processors
12:30 and the phone is ……..
me: mine? Nokia 6021
Mathew: oh thas good i think“,1] ); //–> so if i ever need bluetooth i can buy an adapter
did yu buy a phone too
do yu think i really need 1 GB RAM
cos its a laptop i wanted it to be future proof
12:29 me: Wwell, 1 GB is future proof…and I mant Duo, sorry
I boughta phone, yeah
nothing much
Mathew: cos if i go for 512 MB, there are really cheaper laptops with better processors
12:30 and the phone is ……..
me: mine? Nokia 6021
Mathew: oh thas good i think<!– D([“mb”,”
12:31 me: well, 512 is quitre doable, too, but it depends on how muc cheaper
Its got most connectivity things but no cam or anything
Mathew: mp3? does it play mp3?
oh you already have the muvo
12:32 k so if i go for 512, there\’s the Acer which is 12K lesser
less
hows yr inspiron… is it fast…
12:33 me: well, sort of…installing anything from DVD is slightly slow but everything else is quitre decent
12:34 I already have the MuVo, and I "suggested" the ipod vid 30 GB to my aunt when she asked me what i wanted!!!
“,1] ); //–>
12:31 me: well, 512 is quitre doable, too, but it depends on how muc cheaper
Its got most connectivity things but no cam or anything
Mathew: mp3? does it play mp3?
oh you already have the muvo
12:32 k so if i go for 512, there’s the Acer which is 12K lesser
less
hows yr inspiron… is it fast…
12:33 me: well, sort of…installing anything from DVD is slightly slow but everything else is quitre decent
12:34 I already have the MuVo, and I “suggested” the ipod vid 30 GB to my aunt when she asked me what i wanted!!!
<!– D([“mb”,”Mathew: cooooool
he he
12:35 me: Acer what??
Mathew: aspire 1642zwlmi
12:37 me: I was almost set on buying the 1563 or something b4 i saw the pffer on the dell
1562
Mathew: sit good?
12:38 me: pretty good
12:39 also Duo, with most of the stuffI said, minus card reader but + inbuilt webcam
Mathew: price?
12:40 me: oh hey, how was ure kerala entrance!!???”,1] ); //–>Mathew: cooooool
he he
12:35 me: Acer what??
Mathew: aspire 1642zwlmi
12:37 me: I was almost set on buying the 1563 or something b4 i saw the pffer on the dell
1562
Mathew: sit good?
12:38 me: pretty good
12:39 also Duo, with most of the stuffI said, minus card reader but + inbuilt webcam
Mathew: price?
12:40 me: oh hey, how was ure kerala entrance!!???<!– D([“mb”,”
Mathew: did i tell u bout a book i bought from chennai??
12:41 rank 250
me: slightly higher than the dell
woo!!!
cool!!!
Mathew: pretty surprisng for me
he he
12:42 cudnt contact reenu tho…. any idea wat her rank is?
me: nope
she moved somewhere
Mathew: kozhikode
“,1] ); //–>
Mathew: did i tell u bout a book i bought from chennai??
12:41 rank 250
me: slightly higher than the dell
woo!!!
cool!!!
Mathew: pretty surprisng for me
he he
12:42 cudnt contact reenu tho…. any idea wat her rank is?
me: nope
she moved somewhere
Mathew: kozhikode
<!– D([“mb”,” me: wait…I thk Abhi said something like 400 or so
Mathew: no way……..
me: why?
12:43 remember that girl at Pala? Malini Pillai or something? shes got 40 or so
Mathew: i thot shed get a much better rank
only?
me: no, 26 i think…its in the paper
Mathew: and what abt neetu kurian?
im trying to contact the entrance office now…. i lost myh hallticket
12:44 me: well, its quite enought o get u any college in kerala…besides, i thnk shed get the RECs or something”,1] ); //–> me: wait…I thk Abhi said something like 400 or so
Mathew: no way……..
me: why?
12:43 remember that girl at Pala? Malini Pillai or something? shes got 40 or so
Mathew: i thot shed get a much better rank
only?
me: no, 26 i think…its in the paper
Mathew: and what abt neetu kurian?
im trying to contact the entrance office now…. i lost myh hallticket
12:44 me: well, its quite enought o get u any college in kerala…besides, i thnk shed get the RECs or something<!– D([“mb”,”
no idea
Mathew: yeah she will
me: didnt look all that carefully, and anyway tehy only showeed till hundred or so
12:45 Mathew: k anyhoo, again, did i tell u abt a book i bought from chennai?
me: no, u were abt to
which one?
12:46 Mathew: Does God Play Dice? Ian Stewart
really cool…. its about chaos theory and complexity theory
i think i\’ve found my area of research
12:47 me: I was going to buy that 2 days ago (blore) but then i remember its in our library, and ill just get one of my bros to take it…i bought a ton!!!”,1] ); //–>
no idea
Mathew: yeah she will
me: didnt look all that carefully, and anyway tehy only showeed till hundred or so
12:45 Mathew: k anyhoo, again, did i tell u abt a book i bought from chennai?
me: no, u were abt to
which one?
12:46 Mathew: Does God Play Dice? Ian Stewart
really cool…. its about chaos theory and complexity theory
i think i’ve found my area of research
12:47 me: I was going to buy that 2 days ago (blore) but then i remember its in our library, and ill just get one of my bros to take it…i bought a ton!!!<!– D([“mb”,”
ikts a pretty cool field
Mathew: ah so idid tell this to you
12:48 me: ure area of research?its more math than physics…straddling, but still
Mathew: i know… im gonna work on my math in college
12:49 besides this shadows of the mind is cool too…. im interested in chaos theory cos chaos is complexity from simplicity… somthin that\’ll help in understanding the UP better…. complexity theory is simplicity from complexity… something that\’ll help in understanding human consciousness
12:50 me: interesting…
Mathew: very
12:51 me: ever read the foundation seris by Asimov? The novels r good, but what i found really cool was the concept of Psychohistory”,1] ); //–>
ikts a pretty cool field
Mathew: ah so idid tell this to you
12:48 me: ure area of research?its more math than physics…straddling, but still
Mathew: i know… im gonna work on my math in college
12:49 besides this shadows of the mind is cool too…. im interested in chaos theory cos chaos is complexity from simplicity… somthin that’ll help in understanding the UP better…. complexity theory is simplicity from complexity… something that’ll help in understanding human consciousness
12:50 me: interesting…
Mathew: very
12:51 me: ever read the foundation seris by Asimov? The novels r good, but what i found really cool was the concept of Psychohistory<!– D([“mb”,”
abt reducing mass beahviour to mathematical equations
12:52 Mathew: no i havent….anything to do with AI? and wats psychohistory?
oh
me: c above
12:53 Mathew: i didnt really get yr take on this yet…. dyu think the universe is purely deterministic?
me: individual behaviour asimov maintains, is unprediactable, but the behaviour of a group of ppl is predicatable to soem extent…and the larger the gp, teh surer the predictions
12:54 Mathew: cool…ive thot abt that
see question above
me: no, but i dont think its purely free, either. In fact…”,1] ); //–>
abt reducing mass beahviour to mathematical equations
12:52 Mathew: no i havent….anything to do with AI? and wats psychohistory?
oh
me: c above
12:53 Mathew: i didnt really get yr take on this yet…. dyu think the universe is purely deterministic?
me: individual behaviour asimov maintains, is unprediactable, but the behaviour of a group of ppl is predicatable to soem extent…and the larger the gp, teh surer the predictions
12:54 Mathew: cool…ive thot abt that
see question above
me: no, but i dont think its purely free, either. In fact…<!– D([“mb”,”
remember the butterfly efect in chaos theory?
Mathew: yep
12:55 just because its unpredictable doesnt mean its not detewrministic
what i mean by determinism is whether the universe has only one path of progress or future
me: the fact that such a small change, extrapolated, can cause such a large effect, itslef shows that the universe cannot be deterministic unless you take some overriding and omnipotent divine authority for granted, in which case all of science becomes meaningless
12:56 Mathew: the butterfly effect doesnt imply indeterminism… it implies complexity
12:57 me: and yet, if the concept behind psychohistory, among tohers, is true, then if the laws of human behaviour remain atleast approximately constant, we cannot help saying that we r atleast as much pushed along by the universe as by our own will
“,1] ); //–>
remember the butterfly efect in chaos theory?
Mathew: yep
12:55 just because its unpredictable doesnt mean its not detewrministic
what i mean by determinism is whether the universe has only one path of progress or future
me: the fact that such a small change, extrapolated, can cause such a large effect, itslef shows that the universe cannot be deterministic unless you take some overriding and omnipotent divine authority for granted, in which case all of science becomes meaningless
12:56 Mathew: the butterfly effect doesnt imply indeterminism… it implies complexity
12:57 me: and yet, if the concept behind psychohistory, among tohers, is true, then if the laws of human behaviour remain atleast approximately constant, we cannot help saying that we r atleast as much pushed along by the universe as by our own will
<!– D([“mb”,”12:58 the buitterfly efect implies the possibilty of randomness of a higher "magnitude" arising out of a thoughtless act of a very low "magnitude"
12:59 it introduces a factor that cannot be predicted accurately, atleast as of now
13:00 a factor that can change things in any directons
Mathew: but thas too much of an approximation and geeralization… u wont really affect the group if u "go along" with the group…. but peole arent always in a group…. if i break out of society and decide to nuke the world im changing the fate of the world based on my will
thats nothin but an approximation… infact the reason science suks is bcos its just a big generalization
we describe events with circles and ellipses when a perfect circle or ellipse can never exist
me: whic should rule out determinism
approxmiations work
13:01 “,1] ); //–>12:58 the buitterfly efect implies the possibilty of randomness of a higher “magnitude” arising out of a thoughtless act of a very low “magnitude”
12:59 it introduces a factor that cannot be predicted accurately, atleast as of now
13:00 a factor that can change things in any directons
Mathew: but thas too much of an approximation and geeralization… u wont really affect the group if u “go along” with the group…. but peole arent always in a group…. if i break out of society and decide to nuke the world im changing the fate of the world based on my will
thats nothin but an approximation… infact the reason science suks is bcos its just a big generalization
we describe events with circles and ellipses when a perfect circle or ellipse can never exist
me: whic should rule out determinism
approxmiations work
13:01 <!– D([“mb”,”in fact
the fact that science deals only with approximation
should be enough to tell u that the universe is not purely deterministic
Mathew: see the butterfly effect arises out of the imperfectness of the universe rather than just the UP
13:02 no mathmeatical theory can descibe the universe
PERFECTLY that is
we can always approximate
13:03 me: uh-huh…
13:04 did u get what i meant when i said that the fact that science is approximate rules out determinism?
Mathew: exatly
13:05 BUT only if u mean unpredicatbility when u say indeterminism“,1] ); //–>in fact
the fact that science deals only with approximation
should be enough to tell u that the universe is not purely deterministic
Mathew: see the butterfly effect arises out of the imperfectness of the universe rather than just the UP
13:02 no mathmeatical theory can descibe the universe
PERFECTLY that is
we can always approximate
13:03 me: uh-huh…
13:04 did u get what i meant when i said that the fact that science is approximate rules out determinism?
Mathew: exatly
13:05 BUT only if u mean unpredicatbility when u say indeterminism<!– D([“mb”,”
me: ook, true
Mathew: shouldnt the universe still move along a single path… a single fate
this is my question
13:06 me: but what i sad earlier abt chaos arising from seeming order should rule THAT out, too…it is not simply that its unpredictable bcoz we dont have the tools, its unpredictable coz its the very nature of the universe
13:07 Mathew: no you\’re wrong there…. see chaos isnt really chaos…. chaos is only APPARENT….
me: it doesnt move along a single path because that path doesnt EXIST yet
not unless we choose it
in what way?
“,1] ); //–>
me: ook, true
Mathew: shouldnt the universe still move along a single path… a single fate
this is my question
13:06 me: but what i sad earlier abt chaos arising from seeming order should rule THAT out, too…it is not simply that its unpredictable bcoz we dont have the tools, its unpredictable coz its the very nature of the universe
13:07 Mathew: no you’re wrong there…. see chaos isnt really chaos…. chaos is only APPARENT….
me: it doesnt move along a single path because that path doesnt EXIST yet
not unless we choose it
in what way?
<!– D([“mb”,”Mathew: anything that arises out of ORDER…will …. obviosly move along a single path
13:08 i\’ll give u an example from this guy\’s book
me: ok, lets start over
listen
visualize a thread
Mathew: uh huh
me: a single, perfect, thread without any substrands…a huge thread, but complete and determined
that is tah past
13:09 Mathew: o k?
me: now, at the very end of the thread, visualize uncountable mllions of thin strands…the thread is abrupty cut off and these strands are what should continue it…
“,1] ); //–>Mathew: anything that arises out of ORDER…will …. obviosly move along a single path
13:08 i’ll give u an example from this guy’s book
me: ok, lets start over
listen
visualize a thread
Mathew: uh huh
me: a single, perfect, thread without any substrands…a huge thread, but complete and determined
that is tah past
13:09 Mathew: o k?
me: now, at the very end of the thread, visualize uncountable mllions of thin strands…the thread is abrupty cut off and these strands are what should continue it…
<!– D([“mb”,” Mathew: and let me guess… it branches out infinitely
13:10 me: some are mroe probably than tohers, but all exist, as of NOW
oh yeah
Mathew: many-worlds theory
me: its only when WE make a decision that any of these threads CAN extend
Mathew: a mindless speculation
me: sort of
jsut a visual rep of that
why?
it seems quite feasible to me
“,1] ); //–> Mathew: and let me guess… it branches out infinitely
13:10 me: some are mroe probably than tohers, but all exist, as of NOW
oh yeah
Mathew: many-worlds theory
me: its only when WE make a decision that any of these threads CAN extend
Mathew: a mindless speculation
me: sort of
jsut a visual rep of that
why?
it seems quite feasible to me
<!– D([“mb”,”just depends on how u defnie reality
13:11 Mathew: so an infinite number of yous exist?
these theories are just stuff that aged physicists cook up so that they can feel reassured wid themselves
just escapism
13:12 me: at any moment in teh past, only one of me exists…at any moment in the future, any number of POSSIBLE MEs exist
Mathew: it brings about a dead end to scientific thinking
me: it brings abt an end, true…
Mathew: ok…so this is not the many-worlds theorem
you\’re saying that each person decides the fate of the universe
13:13 what makes a person different from a rock”,1] ); //–>just depends on how u defnie reality
13:11 Mathew: so an infinite number of yous exist?
these theories are just stuff that aged physicists cook up so that they can feel reassured wid themselves
just escapism
13:12 me: at any moment in teh past, only one of me exists…at any moment in the future, any number of POSSIBLE MEs exist
Mathew: it brings about a dead end to scientific thinking
me: it brings abt an end, true…
Mathew: ok…so this is not the many-worlds theorem
you’re saying that each person decides the fate of the universe
13:13 what makes a person different from a rock<!– D([“mb”,”
me: the fate of THERI universe, did u ever read KAnt yet?
Mathew: ok so this IS the many-worlds theory
you\’re saying each person has their own universe
that they decide
13:14 what does that make others? passive observers? or active participants in deciding the fate of MY universe?
me: no no no
Im sayng the bvious fact that each perspn SEEs teh universe THERiw ay
Mathew: i cant believe this is AGAIN a question of free will
13:15 me: and, essentially, thats all they\’re concerned abt
“,1] ); //–>
me: the fate of THERI universe, did u ever read KAnt yet?
Mathew: ok so this IS the many-worlds theory
you’re saying each person has their own universe
that they decide
13:14 what does that make others? passive observers? or active participants in deciding the fate of MY universe?
me: no no no
Im sayng the bvious fact that each perspn SEEs teh universe THERiw ay
Mathew: i cant believe this is AGAIN a question of free will
13:15 me: and, essentially, thats all they’re concerned abt
<!– D([“mb”,”Mathew: k so?
me: well, everything comes down to that, deosnt it/
Mathew: the problem is that free will depends on detern\u003dminism and UP
its a loop
13:16 me: so, gimme a min
Mathew: k
13:17 me: actually, its not quite a loop. not when you consider that if u take my explanation and look at the matter PSYCHOLOGICALLY, free will depends on nothing at all.
Mathew: go ahead
me: ITs obvious that right now, you can do anything you want…if you set ure mind to it, u can go out onto the street naked
“,1] ); //–>Mathew: k so?
me: well, everything comes down to that, deosnt it/
Mathew: the problem is that free will depends on detern=minism and UP
its a loop
13:16 me: so, gimme a min
Mathew: k
13:17 me: actually, its not quite a loop. not when you consider that if u take my explanation and look at the matter PSYCHOLOGICALLY, free will depends on nothing at all.
Mathew: go ahead
me: ITs obvious that right now, you can do anything you want…if you set ure mind to it, u can go out onto the street naked
<!– D([“mb”,”13:18 its entireyl within ure capability
Mathew: no its not
me: but u DON\’T!
Mathew: bah…….. my essa
how come u didnt get my point
me: huh? how?
Mathew: this was the kind of dialogue i intended to mimick in that essay
the NUS essay
13:19 LISTEN
me: hey, i got it, i jsut dont agree iwth it
“,1] ); //–>13:18 its entireyl within ure capability
Mathew: no its not
me: but u DON’T!
Mathew: bah…….. my essa
how come u didnt get my point
me: huh? how?
Mathew: this was the kind of dialogue i intended to mimick in that essay
the NUS essay
13:19 LISTEN
me: hey, i got it, i jsut dont agree iwth it
<!– D([“mb”,”Mathew: theres a reason why i dont go into the street naked
infact the reasons are so complex they just appear random
13:20 (well the reason is quite simple here …. he he)
there are reasons behind everything…can u accept that?
me: actually, in the essay u hide behind the fact that neurosceince is so incomplete…
13:21 Mathew: well IT IS duh
me: I can accept that there are restrictions we set up within our own minds for many things
"That wasn’t really your choice; rather it was a result of complex processes in your brain fuelled by your imagination and past experiences"
Mathew: no its just not even that simple
“,1] ); //–>Mathew: theres a reason why i dont go into the street naked
infact the reasons are so complex they just appear random
13:20 (well the reason is quite simple here …. he he)
there are reasons behind everything…can u accept that?
me: actually, in the essay u hide behind the fact that neurosceince is so incomplete…
13:21 Mathew: well IT IS duh
me: I can accept that there are restrictions we set up within our own minds for many things
“That wasn’t really your choice; rather it was a result of complex processes in your brain fuelled by your imagination and past experiences”
Mathew: no its just not even that simple
<!– D([“mb”,”k?
13:22 me: DUH!!! I(emphasis) am a result of my imagination and past experiences
13:23 k, so whats ure take?
Mathew: imagination… is that what you\’re hinging on?
me: no,no…
lets get to ure essay again
Causality is not deterministic, its only probablistic
13:24 Mathew: imagination is still another by-product of the inherent purely physical nature of our brains
ridiculous…. probability and randomness are terms that …
u know…. they imply that there doesnt have to be a reason behind things
“,1] ); //–>k?
13:22 me: DUH!!! I(emphasis) am a result of my imagination and past experiences
13:23 k, so whats ure take?
Mathew: imagination… is that what you’re hinging on?
me: no,no…
lets get to ure essay again
Causality is not deterministic, its only probablistic
13:24 Mathew: imagination is still another by-product of the inherent purely physical nature of our brains
ridiculous…. probability and randomness are terms that …
u know…. they imply that there doesnt have to be a reason behind things
<!– D([“mb”,”that things can just be this or that… no explanations
13:25 me: sorry, connection probs, repeat the alst couple of sentences pls(cut and paste)
Mathew: ridiculous…. probability and randomness are terms that …
u know…. they imply that there doesnt have to be a reason behind things
that things can just be this or that… no explanations
me: so thats what rue objecting to Lack of explanations?
13:26 Mathew: huh? didnt get u
yes
exactly….. everything has to happen for a reason
me: ure problem with my whole argument is that it terminates at a stage whjere there are no more explanations
right?
“,1] ); //–>that things can just be this or that… no explanations
13:25 me: sorry, connection probs, repeat the alst couple of sentences pls(cut and paste)
Mathew: ridiculous…. probability and randomness are terms that …
u know…. they imply that there doesnt have to be a reason behind things
that things can just be this or that… no explanations
me: so thats what rue objecting to Lack of explanations?
13:26 Mathew: huh? didnt get u
yes
exactly….. everything has to happen for a reason
me: ure problem with my whole argument is that it terminates at a stage whjere there are no more explanations
right?
<!– D([“mb”,”Mathew: if u dont look for reason in something, u wont FIND IT
exactly
13:27 me: ok…
what is gravity,Mathew?
Mathew: puhlease…. there is a reason for gravity and you\’re going to argue that its because of the way the universe is
13:28 that the space-time fabric CAN be folded by mass (without any particular reason)
13:29 me: aargh!! I hate this conection!!!
sorry, something keeps taking over my browser
so…
whats teh reason for gravity, then?
13:31 so,so sorry
“,1] ); //–>Mathew: if u dont look for reason in something, u wont FIND IT
exactly
13:27 me: ok…
what is gravity,Mathew?
Mathew: puhlease…. there is a reason for gravity and you’re going to argue that its because of the way the universe is
13:28 that the space-time fabric CAN be folded by mass (without any particular reason)
13:29 me: aargh!! I hate this conection!!!
sorry, something keeps taking over my browser
so…
whats teh reason for gravity, then?
13:31 so,so sorry
<!– D([“mb”,” Mathew: look in yr chat history to see the last messages i sent you
me: k…
13:33 fine, so whats ure "explanation" for gravity?
beyond curved space, which,as u said, is a dad end?
13:34 Mathew: that IS the explanation for gravity
its AGREEABLE if u stop at a descriptionlike that
13:35 but to say that quantum particles behave in ways that require no reason… thats not AGREEABLE
besides curved space, general relativity… all these only constitute a feasible MODEL of the universe
they dont have to be physical truth
13:37 helloooo?
13:38 “,1] ); //–> Mathew: look in yr chat history to see the last messages i sent you
me: k…
13:33 fine, so whats ure “explanation” for gravity?
beyond curved space, which,as u said, is a dad end?
13:34 Mathew: that IS the explanation for gravity
its AGREEABLE if u stop at a descriptionlike that
13:35 but to say that quantum particles behave in ways that require no reason… thats not AGREEABLE
besides curved space, general relativity… all these only constitute a feasible MODEL of the universe
they dont have to be physical truth
13:37 helloooo?
13:38 <!– D([“mb”,”me: sorry
this really isnt working too well
so why not take mine as a MODEL for theuniverse, since we cant seem to do bettrer?
who defines AGREEABLE?
Mathew: ah … CANT SEEM TO DO BETTER
13:39 isnt it better to keep searching for reason?
me: the idea is that i doubt u can fnid one…not you, humanity in general, because to me its AGREEABLE to stop at that level
Mathew: well agreeable isnt such a concrete term… but isnt it obvious that randomness and lack of reason are glaringly unagreeable?
13:40 me: answer the second q
“,1] ); //–>me: sorry
this really isnt working too well
so why not take mine as a MODEL for theuniverse, since we cant seem to do bettrer?
who defines AGREEABLE?
Mathew: ah … CANT SEEM TO DO BETTER
13:39 isnt it better to keep searching for reason?
me: the idea is that i doubt u can fnid one…not you, humanity in general, because to me its AGREEABLE to stop at that level
Mathew: well agreeable isnt such a concrete term… but isnt it obvious that randomness and lack of reason are glaringly unagreeable?
13:40 me: answer the second q
<!– D([“mb”,”ok
Mathew: it is to me 🙂
13:41 me: this is slightly irritating…lill ttyl. this comp has a spyware thing that keeps popping up and ic ant even close the app
ill get to u on my laptop once i set up net access on it
13:42 Mathew: i gotta go out now
me: ok…
cul
Mathew: talk tyu later
bye
me: bye…

“,0] ); //–>ok